Thursday, August 18, 2005

The Grim Mathematics of Appeasement

Historical context is among the casualties in reporting of Iraq war dead

2.5 years into the Iraq War: 27 Thousand Killed
(American & Iraqi Armies + Iraqi Civilians)

2.5 years into World War II: 17.5 Million Killed

(55 Million Total 1937-1945 Comprised of sixty-one different nationalities)

What if British and American tanks had smashed into Germany in 1935 demolishing Hitler's nascent Third Reich. Does anyone doubt that today the Left would still be decrying this "Unprovoked War of Aggression against Germany?"

sources = Iraqi Body Count, CNN, MilitaryCity, CBS News


Blogger Bohemian Like You said...

This comment placed here for the same purpose that a bartender puts a couple of his own dollars in the tip jar at the beginning of his shift. Comments beget comments.

8/18/2005 11:26:00 PM  
Anonymous Ray b. said...

Bohemian like you wrote:

"What if British and American tanks had smashed into Germany in 1935 demolishing Hitler's nascent Third Reich. Does anyone doubt that today the Left would still be decrying this "Unprovoked War of Aggression against Germany?"


I doubt that the Left would decry it. In fact, many on the Left were hoping we would attack the Facists states of Germany and Italy (and Japan) before Pearl Harbor!

Germany, 1930s/1940s is not Iraq, 2003-2005. WWII was not a war of choice.

8/19/2005 11:19:00 AM  
Blogger Bohemian Like You said...

That's exactly what the appeasers said in 30's England - 11 million signed a petition saying so.

Chamberlain gets blamed, but he truly gave the people what they wanted.

8/19/2005 11:28:00 AM  
Anonymous Ray B. said...

The appeasers in the U.S. in the 1930s were right wing conservatives like Charles Lindbergh.

Listen to a song by a great American Leftist, Woody Guthrie:

Or Read:

Mister Charlie Lindbergh, he flew to old Berlin,
Got 'im a big Iron Cross, and he flew right back again
To Washington, Washington.

Missus Charlie Lindbergh, she come dressed in red,
Said: "I'd like to sleep in that pretty White House bed
In Washington, Washington."

Lindy said to Annie: "We'll get there by and by,
But we'll have to split the bed up with Wheeler, Clark, and Nye
In Washington, Washington."

Hitler wrote to Lindy, said "Do your very worst,"
Lindy started an outfit that he called America First
In Washington, Washington.

All around the country, Lindbergh he did fly,
Gasoline was paid for by Hoover, Clark, and Nye
In Washington, Washington.

Lindy said to Hoover: "We'll do the same as France:
Make a deal with Hitler, and then we'll get our chance
In Washington, Washington

Then they had a meetin', and all the Firsters come,
Come on a-walkin', they come on a-runnin',
In Washington, Washington

Yonder comes Father Coughlin, wearin' the silver chain,
Cash on his stomach and Hitler on the brain.
In Washington, Washington

Mister John L. Lewis would sit and straddle a fence,
His daughter signed with Lindbergh, and we ain't seen her since
In Washington, Washington

Hitler said to Lindy: "Stall 'em all you can,
Gonna bomb Pearl Harbor with the help of old Japan."
In Washington, Washington

Then on a December mornin', the bombs come from Japan,
Wake Island and Pearl Harbor, kill fifteen hundred men.
Washington, Washington

Now Lindy tried to join the army, but they wouldn't let 'im in,
'Fraid he'd sell to Hitler a few more million men.
In Washington, Washington

So I'm a gonna tell you people: If Hitler's gonna be beat,
The common workin' people has got to take the seat
In Washington, Washington.

And I'm gonna tell you workers, 'fore you cash in your checks:
They say "America First," but they mean "America Next!"
In Washington, Washington.

8/19/2005 01:31:00 PM  
Blogger Bohemian Like You said...

You don't see any parallels with the "Michael Moore" wing of the Democratic Party and Charles Lindbergh-America First movement, do you?

8/19/2005 05:33:00 PM  
Anonymous Ray B. said...

I do see something of a parallel with some on the far left and the far right of the past (or the present if you count dead enders like Pat Buchanan). Like many on the left, I was supportive of going into Afganistan. Iraq was another ball game. For those people like Cindy Sheean or others who have come out against the war in Afganistan -- well, I think their totally wrong. I'm not sure where M. Moore is on Afganistan (looks like he ate it).

The reality now is that we can't, as you and FOX News would say, Cut and Run. Smart Democrats (and I'm neither smart nor a Democrat) know that they might inherit Iraq in 2008 so they (Sen. Clinton, Sen. Biden, and others) have to play the roll of loyal opposition carefully knowing they may be in charge one day. Good luck to them.

Getting back to your original point for this post, I still think Iraq was a war of choice and the consequences of this decision by the Bush Administration are major. We've got 1,800 plus dead soldiers, dead innocent Iraqis, nearly 20,000 wounded U.S. soldiers and thousands of innocent Iraqis wounded, plus the 100s of billions of dollars were spending on this -- that's not a victory. It's a major Blunder. It's a diversion from the real war -- I want Osama dead --- and we're making Iraq more dangerous for us than it was -- making Iraq a Real breeding ground for terrorists who stay there for a while, learn how to kill, and then leave for Europe.

This is a major Blunder. If they Bush Admin. was a [real] corporate entity, they'd be fired by now. I know that you agree :-)

check out:

8/20/2005 10:12:00 AM  

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